Well, so much for "Black Friday". We now have a "Black Thursday" with this news as well. What a sad story. !4 year-olds, girls especially, don't have a clue yet as to the ways of the world. They get involved in what most kids in my day would think of as "just having a good time". Next they know, they are in over their head.

I have a friend whose daughter was gang-raped by a 24 year-old illegal alien and 2 of his friends at 15. She was so afraid to tell anybody, she got an ulcer over it. When a best friend of hers who was aware what happened inadvertently let out the secret, the daughter was threatened with her life by the perpetrators, and she was ridiculed throughout her school to boot. Fine bunch of compassionate kids we are raising now - NOT. When her parents finally learned of the incident, the guy had left town for parts unknown and it was too late to make a formal complaint. She luckily didn't get pregnant. She has since dealt with the situation within herself, but also learned the hard way where some of these kid parties can lead.

This guy is nothing more than an animal. I hope they charge his friends with complicity as well. May he get the needle at least. Too bad we don't allow a little more painful and slow way to execute sub-human criminals like this.

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Oh...BUUUURN!!! You tell 'em, thehellyousay!!

Kika was a friend of mine. We've known about the rape almost since day 1 -- this is not new for us -- what we were waiting for was the arrest of this individual.

I'm upset that he was not charged with rape. When he goes to prison I want him to feel what a scared 14 year old would feel. He needs to go through everything she went through for proper punishment...EVERYTHING...but that's what all rape-o's deserve...

Putting the race card aside, in Mexico, they DO view rape and women differently than we do in the US. It is a cultural thing that is slowly changing. I had a friend who was from Mexico, he clearly described to me a rape of a woman. When I pointed out to him that it was rape, he did not see it that way as the young woman was "loose" and got what she was asking for. People who are aware of the cultural differences know this. The Machismo attitude. What really tops this gruesome story is that this man is not even the rapist. So was he protecting another gang member? Is this the norm for these guys? Appalling story!

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by the way, the story is a sad one in multiple levels. 14 year old girl partying way too much with older men, murder, and rape! I feel so sorry for the family.


I still can't believe that American voice was actually claiming that rape isnt seen as an issue in Mexico! That has got to be the dumbest thing anyone has ever said on these comments, ever.


"Hey, in Canada I here assault isn't seen as a bad thing cuz its a cultural thing"... you see how stupid I sounded?

We are going to take our country back in 2010. And yes that means patriotic Native Americans and citizens of this land. The employers of illegal aliens be they ADM or Tyson or local flunkies are all to blame. We know you love the cheap labor and expendable work force and you don't give a rat about the suffering citizens and victims of crime in this valley. According to Senator Patty Murry's office there are approximately 300,000 illegal aliens in this valley (60 to 75% of all hispanics) and guess where they work???? The vast majority of people incarcerated in this county are hispanic. Ask any policeman or jailer. Native Americans are not racist but they may point the way out of this mess for you cowardly head in the sand whites or moronic liberals.

lol!! How can there be 300,000 illegals in the valley when the population of the county is 245,000? And caucasians being the majority? XD

Ogre - I dare you to point out in my comment anything that is racist. Your ignorance amazes me. I mentioned a friend who was raped by an illegal immigrant, and I am a racist??? Get real.

You sound like someone who needs his documents checked - maybe that is why you post anonymously - so you can hide behind obscurity, or "under the radar" as illegal aliens and their apologists like to call it. Of course, I would be embarrassed myself if I were making such uninformed, prejudiced comments.

Nobody said anything about 300,000 illegals in the valley - that number is for the entire state and includes illegals from ALL countries - unless if you want to claim the dubious infamy for Hispanics, be my guest. But you would be wrong again.

American Voice - to add to your "cultural" point of view, a Mexican mother of 4 told me that it is relatively common practice for relatives, even much older ones, to have sex with their nieces as long as they are not related by blood. Furthermore, the age they recognize a ready for the deed is as young as 11-12 years old!

Ogre, what have you to say about that? Do cultural practices fit as a "racist" issue too, or, in your educated opinion on the subject, are there even any other cultures than Hispanic? I can think of a few - and they are not all people of color.

Oh! Forgive me, according to the National Council of La Raza, (The Race) there probably are not any worth mentioning - they would be significantly inferior.

Nick: Had the person who raped your friends' daughter been a legal resident, or natural-born US Citizen, would you have made it a point to mention it in your comment? This story is truly tragic, but nowhere in this article does it mention whether the perp was legal or not (he very well may be, but there's no mention of it.) You know well enough what I'm getting at with my question though. It's doubtful that you would've mentioned anything at all had it been a non-illegal who had committed the crime.

By the way, you asked Ogre who said anything about 300,000 illegals in Valley, read Hawkeye's post. I'm sure it was a typo on his part, but you'll find your answer there.

And Nick and American Voice, your generalization that Mexico as a country, or Mexicans as a people view rape as no big deal is beyond ignorant. No doubt there are many parts of Mexico that are far behind the times, and people's views of things may be horribly wrong in our eyes, but you can't generalize the entire country and it's people the same way.

For example, the same can be said about some backwoods, redneck country in America's Deep South. Rape and other crimes are often viewed in a different light than the rest of the country. Are we to believe then that all Americans have the same beliefs and views?

It's a stupid question, much like your stupid generalization.

An example: Mexican Diego Lopez-Mendez pleaded guilty to sexual assault on a 10-year-old girl in West Virginia, with a not-uncommon excuse that child sex is normal among his people.

"In the pueblo where I grew up girls are usually married by 13 years old....I was unaware of the nature of the offense or that it was a bad crime", said Lopez through the translator. [Illegal Immigrant Pleads Guilty To Sexual Assault, WTOV9 2/28/06]

American Voice: So because "in the pueblo" where this guy grew up in it's common for 13-year-old girls to be married, we should assume that it's like that in all parts of Mexico?

So should I start looking up examples of white "redneck-type" folks in Kentucky, Alabama, etc. that make it a common practice to breed amongst their own family too?

How about the story of former child star Mackenzie Phillips (a US-born citizen white woman) that had a incestual affair with her father? Because of that one story, or others like it, should I assume that this is a common practice?

Again, stupid questions...stupid generalizations.

Lower Valley is right, things are changing in Mexico. The United Nations reported the following: Legal steps to criminalize violence against women

In July 1991, Mexico revised its rape law in several important ways. A provision was eliminated that allowed a man who rapes a minor to avoid prosecution if he agrees to marry her. Now judges are required to hand down a decision regarding access to an abortion within five working days.

Just like the US and the violence against Blacks, which dehumanized and demoralized a minority culture of people, it took many years from the time the laws were changed to the time when our culture and White people, especially in the South, began to change their outlook towards a Black person. In this same context, it is demonstrated that the dehumanization and demoralization of women in some areas of Mexico has not caught up with the laws of the land.

Don't take this so personally, Ogre and LVR. I agree,it is not ok to generalize. And violence against women is rampant in our country as in many countries. I think women often do not speak up for they feel they will not be heard and do not have a voice as they are disempowered. It does not take away from the issues raised in our discourses. Cultural views of acceptance in any country further support the woman's fear to speak up. There ARE cultural differences, both pro and con between the two countries. Get over the emotional attachments and be honest within yourselves!

American Voice:

There are indeed cultural differences between both countries, as with any other countries. I don't think that was in question at all. And I'm with you 100 percent that those differences are both pro and con. Again, that's not really part of the debate.

I don't speak for Ogre, only for myself. While you DO bring up some serious issues that should concern us, my problem lies in the generalization of an entire country or population. You're not the only one that's been guilty of this...it's quite common on these message boards.

By the way, I don't take it personally simply because the debate involves Mexico and I'm of Mexican-decent (before anyone brings that up.) It upsets just as much (more in fact) when people generalize ridiculous things about Americans or our country in general.

"Just like the US and the violence against Blacks, which dehumanized and demoralized a minority culture of people, it took many years from the time the laws were changed to the time when our culture and White people, especially in the South, began to change their outlook towards a Black person. In this same context, it is demonstrated that the dehumanization and demoralization of women in some areas of Mexico has not caught up with the laws of the land."

Excellent post. There was a time where crimes against woman were also viewed quite differently in this country. We should all be thankful that times indeed have changed (for the most.)

for the most PART, I meant.

Check this out:
http://www.asylumlaw.org/docs/mexico/MEX_2/Table_of_Contents.pdf

enough said. my point should well be made..............

LowerValleyReader is right. Look at the bigger picture; a generation or two in country changes a lot, it has not been that long since women in this country were given equal rights. There are plenty of rapes and murders committed by non-hispanics. So let's not argue about immigration issues.
The bigger questions might be: What can we do as a community to support the family who lost their child in this utterly horrific manner? What can we teach all of our children about preventing violence of every type? How many times could this tragedy have been prevented? Your local advocacy program is a source of support for those in pain and for those wanting to help or educate others.

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Dear dear emotional ogre, why are you referring to me in the last quote? You did not quote anything that I said! You are too close to the issue, as you have previously stated that you are mexican, you have never said your were american of mexican decent. were your parents legal citizens?

And I have traveled the world...not that it matters to your limited, emotionally racially charged POV

Let's remember the facts in the case. A man with a hispanic name killed (by slashing the throat) a 14 year old girl with a hispanic name that had passed out at a party and he happened to be driving home.

Now, nowhere is it said that anyone had "legal" or "illegal" status. I don't believe that the Yakima Herald reporters ask this question to law enforcement anymore. It may be Herald-Republic policy not to ask or it may be police policy not to comment. It rarely gets reported in any case. Maybe the Herald-Republic or police can chime in. I know that someone lost their life and a family lost a daughter, but society has and will be put to great cost over this matter. It is important to me, a taxpayer as it is not the only crime committed in and around this valley by people of hispanic origin who may or may not be here legally.

I am not saying that crimes are not committed by citizens, only that crimes ARE committed by illegal aliens from many countries and it should be reported clearly and loudly so that the people of this country can be FULLY informed about the immigration issues in this country. Reporters should ask and report immigration status and police should release this information if they know it. And if someone on this site has a problem with singling out those with hispanic sounding names, then go ahead and ask if "Mike Smith" is a citizen or not when he commits a crime. If common sense has to take a back seat to political correctness with some people, then so be it. But ask and report.

Now to generally comment:
I love how Lower Valley Reader cries about generalizing and stereo-typing and then makes some comments about rednecks in the south. Perfect.

If anyone thinks women are better off today as objects of @#$% and commercialism, then they should think again. Voting rights and workplace rights does not equal better off. 100 years ago, rape of a woman would get someone to the gallows in a hurry. Nowadays it results in elevated social status for the perp, minimal jail time, and possible abortion for the woman which carries long-term physical and mental issues in addition to being raped and a huge financial cost to society.

One hundred years ago a woman could choose to work outside the home (many already worked at home manufacturing products and items for sale or trade in addition to raising children and other work) but nowadays, it has almost become absolutely necessary for a woman to work outside the home in order to make ends meet for families. Is it really better now?

Liberal education policy has tainted many minds in the above posts. One would think that all whites (Christian by historic implication) were pro-slavery and anti-woman back in the day. The civil war started at the signing of our Constitution. I don't know the percentage off hand, but I would be willing to bet that more than half of all whites in this country opposed slavery at the time. The rest were probably opposed to it(knew it was wrong), but to morally weak to do anything about it because their income was tied to it. In any case, hundreds of thousands of whites died trying to preserve the union from the rift of slavery, essentially dying for blacks to be free. The civil war was fought to separate (generally) white southern slave owners from their (illegitimate) property and income.

The more I read of my fellow countrymen, the more I see the life of this country slipping away. People used to aspire to freedom and justice and now they will willingly take on the chains of falsehood and lies as well as vice and hate.
We have all become slaves of sorts to ideals painted with shades of gray.

NG, excellent post. But one major thing you need to be aware of, is that the blogs got off-track. They really took on a new life and had nothing at all to do with the current article. We switched due to a comment of Nick's, then the blogs were referencing his blog and subsequent statements. That is how these blogs go.............

We know nothing about the people in the article, and the comments were not about those people and that poor girl.

Another point, NG- Young women in our community today are objectifying themselves. They do not seem to have any idea of the struggles the women in the '60's went through to break out of the confinements and structures they were forced to live in. And before that, the sufferagate women and their struggles. The discussion was about cultural acceptances and norms. Sex sells, it always has. Abuse is prolific in America. I also believe it is much more exposed and talked about than in many other cultures. So while there are horrific issues, in this country, if a woman has the courage to confront the issues, she at least can find a way to change her circumstances. But often the disempowered do not know that their voice will be heard. That is the common language of the victim.

When you speak about women and culture, or the way that men view women in a "cultural context", whom are you comparing to? As that is really what our discussion was about.

Another big, driving issue is the frustrations many of us are feeling about the never-ending flow of illegal immigrants in our country and the effect that has on our socio-economic system!

NewGuard: "I love how Lower Valley Reader cries about generalizing and stereo-typing and then makes some comments about rednecks in the south. Perfect."

I love it how the sarcasm in my comments went right over your head. Perfect.

Go back and read my comments and you'll see clearly (at least to most readers) that I was comparing my "stupid questions" about redneck country to the "stupid generalizations" of Mexico and it's people posted by others. Try reading a little slower and more carefully next time.

"Dear dear emotional ogre, why are you referring to me in the last quote? You did not quote anything that I said! You are too close to the issue, as you have previously stated that you are mexican, you have never said your were american of mexican decent. were your parents legal citizens?"

What kind of Mexican lives in the US for 18 of 21 years, is perfectly profecient in English, and has scored higher in the WASL than 99.5 percent of all test takers?

Either way, your statements are irrelevent to the issue, as has been stated, the article never even mentions anyone's immigration status and you and Nick are on some profound journey to denigrate a whole class of people simply because it suits you.


A racist is one thing, but denying it? Thats just pathetic. You lack confidence in your argument if you think I can't recall you and Nick squeezing some sort of "blame illegal" comments every time you think its convenient to blame them, even when it has nothing to do with the topic, such as this one.


Seriously, you're so ignorant is makes people's head hurt. Its sad that we have some crazy racists in this valley actually making comments like "rape isn't seen as an issue in Mexico", seriously are you braindead?

As I said, theres been more cases in the US, but I don't see you making stupid generalizations?

I'm emotional because it breaks my heart knowing that bigots like you and Nick are still breathing in today's world.

oh, and by the way, I'm the only way actually citing all my sources from government agencies, so you can't argue with the facts, just shows that you guys would RATHER BELIEVE that illegal immigrants are a scourge on society instead of actually looking at the facts and seeing all the benefits.

I've shown you that illegal immigrants have the lowest crime rates in the US and the best you can come up with is "I heard one instance in which...ect"? Seriously can't you even see how pathetic that is? Did you graduate from highschool?

p.s. if you guys care to look at the US beuro of mortality statistics (you know, that government run agency that keeps track of all official death statistics in the US)... you'd see that most rapes in the US are comitted by caucasians, most arsons by caucasians, most assaults by caucasions, most murders by caucasians.


But you won't see me making over simplyfying profound generalizations based on a few misconceptions I've heard like you and Nick are doing.

Legal is legal illegal is illegal. Economy is hurting. Can't keep paying for babies for non-citizens. The laws need to be enforced. That is all that needs to occur.

Heh, now you're over simplifying your own arguments. Then what was all the claims about rape being okay in Mexico, common incestual pracices, and so on?


p.s. take macro and micro economics in college! That way when you see the pouring of illegal immigrants tax dollars into the system, is actually helping your social security!

and you've yet to give a good explanation of WHY legal and illegal immigration is such a big deal to you? With the exception of a few documents, theyre pretty much the same!

But whatever justifies your racism and prejudice I suppose.

American Voice: Nobody is arguing the fact that "legal is legal" or "illegal is illegal." I'm sure everyone would agree on that. I don't see where that debate came from based on this article. I'll blame it on Nick for his original post...just to blame it on someone. ;-)

By the way, whether we like "paying for babies for non-citizens" or not, if you're born here you are indeed a US Citizen. Whether that's right or wrong is something totally different.

Germans, Irish, and Italians did it for centuries, but hey, they're not brown so it must be a lot easier to like them, huh?

The current governor and GOP member of California was an illegal immigrant too, but since Austria isn't viewed as Hispanic I suppose that makes all the difference.

LVR...point taken. My apologies.

American Voice wrote:
"They do not seem to have any idea of the struggles the women in the '60's went through to break out of the confinements and structures they were forced to live in. And before that, the sufferagate women and their struggles. The discussion was about cultural acceptances and norms. Sex sells, it always has. Abuse is prolific in America. I also believe it is much more exposed and talked about than in many other cultures. So while there are horrific issues, in this country, if a woman has the courage to confront the issues, she at least can find a way to change her circumstances. But often the disempowered do not know that their voice will be heard. That is the common language of the victim."

The struggle to what? The struggle to raise a family? Get married? Work? What got better in the sixties? Free love? Promiscuity? Access to abortion? I would tend to think that women are much more marginalized by modern feminism than ever before in this country. Women gained what in the sixties? And how did it make them "better off"? The language you use when you say "confinements and structures they were forced to live in", you make it sound as if women everywhere hated their position or status in life. The majority of women still live under the exact same conditions today, not by force but by choice, now, just as they did then...now they just have to work or their families will not be able to afford the government rent and fees (taxes).

AmericanVoice wrote: "When you speak about women and culture, or the way that men view women in a "cultural context", whom are you comparing to? As that is really what our discussion was about."

I'm comparing them in time, say pre-60's to post-60's. Has it changed for the better? What rights or privileges do women have now they didn't have in the 50's? And if they have anything more now, are they better off for it? My argument is no, they are not. They are much more objectified now than then, but now, they tend to lend themselves to objectification by bowing to societal pressures in conforming to images given to them by a deluded society in magazines and television and movies.

look up yakima co crime stoppers , under sex crimes there is 35 hispanic and 1 nonhispanic that are wanted for sex crimes